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Post by paulpogue on Nov 2, 2008 19:33:43 GMT -8
After reading that bit, I believe the words of Dave from "Code Monkeys" are most appropriate: "Wait I'msorryIwashighWHATwasthat?"
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Post by michaelpaciocco on Nov 3, 2008 8:06:05 GMT -8
Yeah, I'm just trying to address the levels of stupidity.
1) Marvel thinks Peter (and the fans) are idiots - OK, so, the whole "Is Jackpot MJ?", the only reason anyone gave a shit about Jackpot, was false (as we expected), but Peter took it in...because? I mean, the only reason the readers could have bought it was because, hey, the resemblance, and that's all we had to go on, what with the medium of comics being what it is, and given that 80% of artists only know how to draw 1-2 different female body types, that's an easy sell. But Peter? Whom, even using "BND continuity" (Oxymoron, but just go with it for the moment), Peter would still have lived with her, still known her intimately. So, you mean to tell me that Jackpot was the world's greatest MJ impersonator? That she pulled off the same voice, speech patterns, build, smell, mannerisms and body language to fool a former lover? Are you fucking kidding me?
2) Holy Fucking God, the Initiative was fucking scammed by a celebrity impersonator and a black marketeer! Holy fucking fuck, this is akin to finding out that hey, all you need is a cop uniform and you actually can go out policing the streets and doing whatever you want with impunity! And here's the thing: again, there will be ABSOLUTELY ZERO FALLOUT FROM THIS. No one will learn a goddamned thing because it will be swept under the rug, not by the government, but by Marvel Editorial. If they had half a wit about "realism" this alone would be enough to get Stark's ass astroturfed and maybe throw apart the entire SHRA. I mean, after all, if all you have to do is dress up as a 'hero', what's stopping say, Hydra, from having someone dressed up as say, the Sentry going into SHIELD HQ and stealing OH WAIT THAT'S PROBABLY ALREADY GONNA HAPPEN NEVERMIND.
FUCK MARVEL IS FUCKING STUPID.
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Post by Anders on Nov 7, 2008 8:24:28 GMT -8
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Post by michaelpaciocco on Nov 7, 2008 13:41:57 GMT -8
ok...That's better. Nice Anders. and Thanks for fixing that Mario.
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Post by michaelpaciocco on Nov 7, 2008 13:50:30 GMT -8
and while I'm at it....
It's Just Some Random guy has put up the latest installment...in which BND is an actual plot point!
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Post by Mario Di Giacomo on Nov 8, 2008 17:21:59 GMT -8
All part of the service ;D
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Post by K-Box on Nov 19, 2008 20:55:43 GMT -8
ICv2 has posted its sales figures and analysis for October, so we * will be using those to track the sales trends for the NuSpidey era to date, together with previously released monthly sales figures also drawn from ICv2:  *Yes, I said "we." For a while now, I've been doing the math for the issue-to-issue and month-to-month percentages myself, but apparently, being on vacation has made me math-retarded, because I somehow couldn't manage to do the middle school-level math that's required to come up with the correct numbers, so instead, I simply borrowed the results posted by Somebody (no, I'm not being deliberately vague; that's his or her actual online handle) on the Spider-Man Message Board of Alvaro's ComicBoards. As it stands, I already got the HTML for my spiffy sales charts by slightly modifying the sales charts posted by Somebody on the SMB (the rainbow spectrum is my main revision of dubious merit), so here's hoping he or she won't mind me borrowing further. Thanks, Somebody. Anyway, on to the topic at hand ... **All of these issues were part of "New Ways to Die." The good news for NuSpidey supporters is that my previous post was wrong, and all but the last one of these six issues have picked up significant numbers of reorders: Amazing Spider-Man #568 = 6,967Amazing Spider-Man #569 = 8,482***Amazing Spider-Man #570 = 7,037***Amazing Spider-Man #571 = 6,496Amazing Spider-Man #572 = 4,646******These were the John Romita Jr. variant covers of those issues, which leads me directly into the bad news for NuSpidey supporters, which is the fact that ALL six issues of "New Ways to Die" had MULTIPLE covers: Amazing Spider-Man #568 = 4 coversAmazing Spider-Man #569 = 2 coversAmazing Spider-Man #570 = 3 coversAmazing Spider-Man #571 = 2 coversAmazing Spider-Man #572 = 2 coversAmazing Spider-Man #573 = 4 coversWhy is this bad news for NuSpidey supporters? Well, here's the total sales to date for "New Ways to Die," including reorders: Amazing Spider-Man #568 = 100,362Amazing Spider-Man #569 = 86,432Amazing Spider-Man #570 = 89,516Amazing Spider-Man #571 = 80,178Amazing Spider-Man #572 = 79,810Amazing Spider-Man #573 = 82,550Now, there's obviously not a directly proportional relationship here, but even the NuSpidey supporters would have to admit that the peaks and valleys of the numbers of a) covers and b) issues sold are similar - when the numbers of covers went up, the numbers of issues sold went up, and when the numbers of covers went down, the numbers of issues sold went down. So, while I'd agree with the NuSpidey supporters that it'd be going overboard to completely discount the reorders - after all, those numbers are based on customer demand - I'd also argue against the NuSpidey supporters' assertions that such customer demand can be attributed entirely to customer support for the actual content of these issues, as opposed to acknowledging that a significant number of these customers are completist collectors who were willing to buy multiple copies of each issue simply to obtain all the covers. That being said, let's be generous to the NuSpidey supporters, and take the total sales figures for "New Ways to Die" at face value. The first issue's sales were the fourth-highest to date of the NuSpidey era, and I'm willing to discount the second issue drop-off, especially since that had ticked back up a bit by the third issue. However generous I'm willing to be, though, I still can't discount the fact that there was another sharp drop-off exactly midway through the storyline, especially since the sales of the remaining three issues remained relatively level, even with the slight uptick for the final issue. Of course, this is all short-term thinking, which is largely irrelevant in the long term. Stunts like "Brand New Day" and "New Ways to Die" always boost sales to some degree in the short term, but unless they lead to significant, sustained sales gains in the long term, they can't stop creator replacements, changes in editorial directions, or even cancellations of titles. Amazing Spider-Man is never going to get cancelled, and the rotating nature of the NuSpidey "brain trust" has rendered creator replacements irrelevant, so all that's left is the title's editorial direction. So, will "New Ways to Die" prevent this editorial direction from being changed? Well, let's go back to the math. The last issue of July, the month before the first issue of "New Ways to Die" hit the stands, sold 68,912 copies. The last issue of October, the month that the last issue of "New Ways to Die" hit the stands, sold 68,913 copies. That's a net gain of exactly ONE CUSTOMER. Expect that gain to be wiped out in November. If I recall correctly, Paul O'Brien estimated that the combined average monthly sales for the three ongoing Spider-Man titles before "Back in Black" and "One More Day" was roughly 63K per issue, and the reason he came up with that magic number was because, in his opinion, as long as the NuSpidey era could keep its sales above 63K per issue, then the new status quo could be considered "justified." We're getting closer and closer to that "justification" being revoked ...
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Post by K-Box on Dec 16, 2008 15:29:14 GMT -8
ICv2 has posted its sales figures and analysis for November, so once again, we'll be using those to track the sales trends for the NuSpidey era to date, together with previously released monthly sales figures also drawn from ICv2: THE NEW PHONEBOOKS ARE HERE!!! THE NEW PHONEBOOKS ARE HERE!!!Now, with all of that being said, what's the one thing that stands out to me about this month? WELCOME TO THE 66K MARK, NUSPIDEY.Realistically speaking, this is actually a lower sales level than I expected for November. As I said last month, I was simply hoping that sales would sink to the 67K mark, so that NuSpidey supporters would have less grounds to claim that the title's sales are finally "leveling off." More than a three-percent month-to-month sales drop at this stage of the game is not good, and it's especially bad coming immediately after an issue that experienced such a spike in sales. We've at last reached the point where variant covers aren't even boosting sales in the short term, let alone the long term (or, if they are boosting sales, then the reality of the title's sales situation is even more dire than these numbers might indicate). I'll wrap up this post with a couple of homework assignments for you all, albeit on a strictly voluntary basis. I seem to recall Paul O'Brien saying that 63K is the "magic number" at which the average per-issue thrice-monthly NuSpidey sales will officially be less than the average per-issue sales of all three prior monthly Spider-Man titles combined, but I don't want to think that I know this; I want to know it. Can somebody provide me with a link to where O'Brien stated, flat-out, what the "magic number" is, so that I can offer it up as evidence, if and when we ever reach that mark? Also, when's the last time that Amazing Spider-Man was selling as low as 66K per issue? I'm guessing it was during the Byrne and Mackie era, but again, I don't want to guess; I want exact issue numbers and sales numbers, and again, I want a source that I can cite for those. Do this for me, and you'll receive ... I don't know, 15 seconds of Internet Fame on my LJ. Seriously, though, you'll get due credit and appreciation from me here.
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Post by jbhelfrich on Dec 16, 2008 15:38:38 GMT -8
pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/2008/01/30/marvel-month-to-month-sales-december-2007/"The reboot is a high risk strategy, and I suspect that after the initial burst of excitement, the new AMAZING will settle down at a significantly lower number. But let’s not forget the bigger picture. Between September 2006 and August 2007, the three Spider-Man titles sold a combined total of 2,284,676 copies in the North American direct market. If the new AMAZING achieves its target of 36 issues a year, it can match that total with a relatively modest audience of 63,463."
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Post by K-Box on Dec 16, 2008 15:43:29 GMT -8
Thank you, Joe (it is Joe, isn't it?). You have earned a mention in my next LJ post.
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Post by jbhelfrich on Dec 16, 2008 15:51:20 GMT -8
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Post by K-Box on Dec 16, 2008 16:21:16 GMT -8
The economy is obviously going to impact comics sales, yes, but then again, I wonder if part of that might also be the fact that most mainstream superhero comics are shit across the board. When even die-hard Bendis boarders start complaining about the latest Bendis-helmed line-wide crossover being a cheap copout, and telling Bendis on his board that they're quitting, it doesn't indicate anything good for almost any mainstream superhero comics. The fact remains that, regardless if it's one title or several that's experiencing a slump, it's still largely Marvel's fault (and DC's) if their customers start dropping off in droves. I would, once again, point to the essay I posted here not too long ago, in which my UK friend managed to do an astonishingly good job of describing all the ways in which most modern mainstream superhero comics are irreconcilably out of sync with the current zeitgeist. Saying, "Well, EVERYBODY'S doing poorly now!" does NOT keep people from getting FIRED, in ANY profession.
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Post by jbhelfrich on Dec 16, 2008 16:36:17 GMT -8
Yes, but you should adjust for the numbers. Pick a DC title or three with a reasonably coherent creative team and no major story changes. Calculate the percentage it's sales changed in the time period you're talking about, and adjust your targets accordingly.
I'm not saying you're wrong entirely, but you need to at least acknowledge industry trends.
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Post by jensaltmann on Dec 16, 2008 23:57:06 GMT -8
When even die-hard Bendis boarders start complaining about the latest Bendis-helmed line-wide crossover being a cheap copout, and telling Bendis on his board that they're quitting Link, please. I could use something to cheer me up. |
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Post by K-Box on Dec 17, 2008 3:53:23 GMT -8
Yes, but you should adjust for the numbers. Pick a DC title or three with a reasonably coherent creative team and no major story changes. Calculate the percentage it's sales changed in the time period you're talking about, and adjust your targets accordingly. I'm not saying you're wrong entirely, but you need to at least acknowledge industry trends. Actually, I don't, because ICv2 already did it for me: So, it turns out that you and I were both wrong, because the average individual comic is actually selling better, in spite of a bad economy. I didn't think it was possible, but this makes the NuSpidey sales look even worse, by comparison, than they did before. |
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