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Post by jasonlatta on Jun 28, 2009 20:55:35 GMT -8
I just wanted a place where I could talk about whatever random comics stuff came floating into my head. So, here is the thread I created! Enjoy.
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1) What actor or person should play what character in the inevitable Nerd Fiction movie?
These are the kind of questions nerds ask that always make for fun threads. There are really no wrong answers!
Or maybe there are. Hmmm.
I'll start with some thoughts:
Why the fuck did UFC heavyweight Champ (for now, at least) Brock Lesnar not play the Juggernaut in the horrid third X-men movie?
LOOK at that motherfucker! He's a human wrecking machine! Put the armor on him and NOTHING CAN STOP THE BROCK! No CGI needed...Lesnar looks like he can run through a brick wall right now...and let's face it, it's not exactly a part that requires a Shakespearean range to play, either.
I demand that Lesnar be digitally inserted into my waste-of-cash copy of X-men the last stand...at least it would be fucking SOMETHING to enjoy.
(And while I'm on subject for a moment, let's put some fuckin' blood into that POS Wolverine movie, too, shall we? That movie sucks shit through a three quarter pipe, I'll grant you, but hey, let's at least admit to ourselves that the main character has razor sharp knives sticking out of his hands half the time! Therefore when he slashes somebody there should be BLOOD. By happenstance I watched that film twice in the theater and I don't remember so much as a tiny dollop of blood throughout the film! Really? Yes...REALLY.)
Next, I'm not sure if you guys follow the Wheel of Time fantasy series formally written by now dead author Robert Jordan, but the guy who plays the vampire in the recent film Twilight is perfect to play a young Rand al'Thor. He is capable of looking handsome and conflicted, which I figure is really all the part needs.
Staying on that series of Nerdity for a moment, I figure sex symbol Angelina Jolie-Pitt (right?) should play Lanfear, as the seductive bitch-goddess figure that tempts Rand for much of the series. Come to the Dark Side and suckle upon these Pitt-Hardened Nipples, Boy! The One Power compels You! hahahhahhahahaha
If Ice-T could gain forty pounds of muscle he'd be ok as Luke Cage.
I dunno. Strike that last.
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Give me your random thoughts that are not worthy of a full thread!
and respond to the posts of others when you feel the need to.
Verily! (a word I only know from Thor comics, but which I'll use in real life at the smallest opportunity.)
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Post by michaelpaciocco on Jun 29, 2009 7:00:25 GMT -8
1) One thing I've noticed watching the first four Star Trek films - there's an almost pagan-ritual-sacrifice thing going down with new, younger characters dying/being shuffled off stage for their older, "classic" counterparts. Now, imagine for a moment that you reverse the trend, and you had
-James T. Kirk, and not William Decker, sacrificing himself in the first movie
-Montgomery Scott, and not his nephew, dying in the Engine room in Wrath of Khan
-David Marcus not dying (this is a hard one for me, because I really just hate the concept of David Marcus)
-Saavik not being shuffled off-stage.
Now try to imagine a series of movies or a TV series with Capt. William Decker, Young Scott, Saavik and David Marcus...you know, it might not be toooo bad (ok, acting wise, yeah, probably, but conceptually? Maybe-maybe-not.)
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Christ, but "Old Man Logan" is quite possibly one of the worst comics I've ever read
I think "Old Man Logan" is the epitome of everything WRONG about big two super-comics - it litterally coasts on using Nostalgia and telling and not showing you.
As an example, this scene would be totally in place in OML:
BLIND OLD HAWKEYE AND LOGAN DRIVING IN DESSERT
HAWKEYE: Where are we?
LOGAN: Outside a place called Forbush, Wyoming
HAWKEYE: Man...here? Wow...you know what happened here?
LOGAN: I heard. He saved the entire state. Fought off the Sinister Six Thousand and Ultron 940. Moved the population to that abandoned base on Mars.
HAWKEYE: He was the greatest of us all
DOUBLE PAGE SPREAD SHOWING A DEVESTATED LANDSCAPE, AND A SHRINE BUILT AROUND A SINGLE OVERTURNED POT WITH EYEHOLES IN IT
And the Manboy Fanboys would EAT THAT SHIT UP. That's why I can't stand "Old Man Logan"
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Marvel is really on a 70s kick right now, when you think about it.
To give a dramatic illustration, let's compare Marvel's biggest gun with a pair of hacks. Brian Bendis vs. Abnett and Lanning. Both of them are currently working on 70s properties (Abnett and Lanning on "HOLY SHIT WE'VE GOT NOVA AND FUCKING ROCKET RACOON AND GODDAMN ADAM WARLOCK AND STARLORD WHO NO ONE HAS EVER GIVEN A SHIT ABOUT EVER" (Guardians of the Galaxy and Nova), and Bendis with "SPIDER WOMAN AND LUKE CAGE AND BROTHER VOODOO AND MS MARVEL ARE FUCKING AWESOME AND NO ONE BUT ME HAS EVER REALIZED HOW SPECIAL SPECIAL THEY ARE" (New Avengers). Obstensibly, these are the same thing really - a fetish for 70s characters that have lain dormant and are being revived simply to keep the intellectual property alive. What is different is that while Bendis has technical skill and an ear for dialogue and a large fan following, he assumes that you actually give a shit about Luke Cage or Spider-Woman to begin with. I don't, so I generally don't give a shit about New Avengers aka "Brian Bendis REALLY loves 70s characters". In contrast, Abnett and Lanning are competent craftsman who actually realize that ABSOLUTELY NO ONE knows who Starlord and Rocket Raccoon are, or are even that familiar with Nova, so they take the time and effort to construct passable, if not particularly innovative, narrative structures that do a minimal job of investing you in the character. You may not end up caring anyway, or you may not like the story one way or another, but at least they do the minimum job of trying to build emotional investment.
Of course, what will be interesting is when the next generation of "fans turned pro" enter comics and we get revivals of 80s and 90s stuff. Yeah, that'll be...something...god only knows what though.
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On Bendis again - but I guess the point of his work on the Avengers franchise now is to remold the #1 superteam of the Marvel Universe into a noir setting, and man the failings of that approach are obvious, especially in the latest issue where Hawkeye says "we have to kill Norman Osborn" because 1) that is so insanely out of character for Hawkeye that it beggars description, and 2) because that kind of logic only works in mob movies. I don't think many of the writers at Marvel realizes that noir genre logic doesn't...actually, you know, WORK IN REAL LIFE. But again, maybe this is just the result of too many like minds in the Bullpen.
Michael
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Post by jensaltmann on Jun 29, 2009 8:00:34 GMT -8
Now try to imagine a series of movies or a TV series with Capt. William Decker, Young Scott, Saavik and David Marcus...you know, it might not be toooo bad (ok, acting wise, yeah, probably, but conceptually? Maybe-maybe-not.) That would've actually deserved to be called Star Trek the Next Generation. |
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Post by michaelpaciocco on Jun 29, 2009 8:13:15 GMT -8
My thoughts exactly, but then again, keep in mind that Riker/Troi was pretty explicitly based on Roddenberry's original plans for Decker/Ilia in the aborted "Star Trek: Phase II" TV project.
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Post by jkcarrier on Jun 29, 2009 8:33:35 GMT -8
Now try to imagine a series of movies or a TV series with Capt. William Decker, Young Scott, Saavik and David Marcus...you know, it might not be toooo bad (ok, acting wise, yeah, probably, but conceptually? Maybe-maybe-not.) I suspect that was the original plan -- slowly introduce new characters who could eventually take center stage. But it quickly became clear that a) none of the new characters were really catching on, and b) the old crew were perfectly willing to keep showing up for the big paycheck (and audiences still wanted to see them), so those ideas fell to the wayside. That would be almost as cool as his appearance in NextWave. ;D Which is both baffling and a little depressing for me. All through the '80s and '90s, I watched all my favorite stories and characters mocked, repudiated, and retconned beyond recognition. "Where are all the creators who grew up on the same stuff I did?" I wondered. Now they're finally here, and yet I find most of their stuff completely unreadable. |
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Post by jasonlatta on Jul 3, 2009 9:48:49 GMT -8
I see that Mark Millar still has good plotting skills but still writes what to me reads like juvenile dialog for his characters, as evidenced by his current issue of Fantastic Four. The words seem stilted and unnatural, as though the characters are poor actors reading their lines from cue cards off panel. I admit they get the point across but something about their flow grates on me.
Robert Kirkman has the same weakness, although he's improved markedly in the last two years...the writing in the newest issue of Invincible is a definite improvement over that found in the first 20 issues.
I'm no great writer myself, clearly, but after spending some time reading plays by the likes of Tennessee Williams, man, those characters have *got* to sound like PEOPLE, or I can't fully enjoy the work, regardless of how enjoyable the plotting and/or "mad, beautiful ideas" are.
Warren Ellis writes great dialog, as do several other comics writers. Ellis' greatest strength, in fact, is probably his ability to make spoken exposition entertaining to read. It seems to me that the "best" comics writers all have some variation of this skill...it's probably a necessity, given the confines of the word bubble.
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Post by jasonlatta on Jul 3, 2009 10:10:00 GMT -8
I am enjoying Morrison's new Batman and Robin comic. I missed out on the whole Batman Is Dead thing over the last few months, and dove back in to feed my wilted Bat addiction with Batman & Robin #1. The last DC comic I read before this was Final Crisis #7. As far as I know, Bruce is still trapped in 10,000 BC playing out his role as Morrison's superhero Odysseus, while his sons take over his house back at home.
The juxtaposition of the new hovercar Batmobile, new headquarters, new sidekick, new hero with the return of soundeffects, and the seriously bizarre (and scary in a way Joker has not been in ages) Pyg and his circus of crime, er, strange, evokes for me memories of comics from my less jaded days.
I almost wish they'd put the sensationalist tagline ALL NEW! ALL DIFFERENT! above the title, though admittedly that's a bit redundant, seeing as how the redesigned logo already tells you things have changed.
I couldn't help but notice the comic began with the Dynamic Duo chasing a Mr. Toad in a wild ride. I can't help it, that made me smile. And it seems to point the direction this series is going to take: a theme park amusement rollercoaster ride.
That's fine with me. Broody, tortured supergenius Batman was getting old. Maybe eating woolly mammoth and constructing his timemachine out of sabretooth tiger bones for the inevitable return will mellow him out a little so that Bruce is more fun when he makes his comeback in about 12 months or so...
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Post by Anders on Jul 3, 2009 12:45:49 GMT -8
I can only agree on Batman & Robin. I've only read the first issue yet (the second might make it over here by next week), but it was... well, fun. Quietly's art doesn't hurt either, and the colours are beautiful even if it isn't Laura doing them.
The only drawback was the horrendous amount of ads in the book. I was tempted to drop it from my pull list and just wait for the collection right away, but I think I'll try to stand it one more issue and decide after that.
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Post by michaelpaciocco on Jul 4, 2009 5:58:50 GMT -8
Robert Kirkman has the same weakness, although he's improved markedly in the last two years...the writing in the newest issue of Invincible is a definite improvement over that found in the first 20 issues. Christ yes. "I don't care how strong you are. I don't care how fast you are. I can see the future, and you don't live to see tomorrow" is quite possibly the most cold-bloodedly awesome line I've read in a superhero comic since Midnighter's monologue in Authority#1 |
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Post by jasonlatta on Jul 4, 2009 10:26:42 GMT -8
Robert Kirkman has the same weakness, although he's improved markedly in the last two years...the writing in the newest issue of Invincible is a definite improvement over that found in the first 20 issues. Christ yes. "I don't care how strong you are. I don't care how fast you are. I can see the future, and you don't live to see tomorrow" is quite possibly the most cold-bloodedly awesome line I've read in a superhero comic since Midnighter's monologue in Authority#1 Oh, yeah. Not to spoil things for those who haven't read it, but the latest issue finally cemented Invincible as a "must read", at least for the time being. I'll dish out a few bucks every month to keep up with this. I actually found myself hoping that one character isn't really dead...and the great thing is, with Kirkman, he's got a history of offing major characters, so this has real dramatic weight, which is nice to see in the increasingly stale superhero genre. |
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Post by Anders on Jul 5, 2009 9:36:08 GMT -8
And this just after I decided to drop Invincible. Hmpf.
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Post by michaelpaciocco on Jul 5, 2009 15:41:24 GMT -8
The End League is a well-intentioned misfire: In all the interviews, Rick Remender states that his intention was to show that a world in which "an average human being at random gets superpowers" would not be favorable to "the good guys", but we never see that. Instead we see a bunch of thinly-veiled DC and Marvel Analogues, and how the thinly-veiled analogues for Lex Luthor, the Red Skull, and Joker turn the planet into a toilet. I mean, it's not bad per se, but it doesn't really address Remender's intention to show what "real people" would be like with superpowers because most people wouldn't become anything like Superman or Spider-Man or Batman or the Red Skull or the Joker - most people would be somewhere in between. Irredeemable suffers from a similar conceit, and thus failure.
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Post by jasonlatta on Jul 5, 2009 19:26:42 GMT -8
Not to derail from your thoughts about End League, which I haven't read and don't plan too in the next decade, at least, but...
You mentioned "real" ordinary people gaining super powers and hence reacting as real folk would in such a predicament, and I got to wondering, when has that ever been done well in comics?
I am certain it has been only rarely...At Marvel most of the characters were at the very least super geniuses before they received their particular tap on the cosmic shoulder and became superheroes. Reed Richards, Henry Pym, Tony Stark, Bruce Banner, Charles Xavier, Peter Parker, etc. even Donald Blake was a medical doctor before finding the hammer.
Meanwhile (ha!) DC's heroes seem to come from sensationalist glamor jobs or lifestyles before they became heroes...Bruce Wayne is a billionaire, Green Arrow too, Wonder Woman was designed by gods out of clay (!), the Martian Manhunter is a an alien, Superman is ANOTHER alien, Green Lantern was a test pilot, and Flash was a police scientist.
All representive of large segments of the population, for sure.
Where are the "real people as superheroes "?
Let's see...Uhm...I'm coming up with Animal Man and the Warriors of Plasm.
Yup. Maybe some of Valiant comics early characters, but, not really.
I still think this is an ideal we have yet to properly see...because if somebody is truly ordinary and gains Powers, they'll still be fucking boring...which is why we read superhero comics in the first place, to escape that boredom.
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Post by michaelpaciocco on Jul 5, 2009 21:01:19 GMT -8
WildCards, for one.
A little bit of the New Universe.
I'm not saying it'd be great, but yeah, my point is that if you go out and say "this is what real people with powers would be like" you should NOT be giving us the 1058th version of Batman
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Post by Anders on Jul 5, 2009 21:10:20 GMT -8
Average people with superpowers would probably be like your average rock star: you'd get Britney, Jacko, Springsteen, Dylan, Bono... Most would start out as decent and "normal"; some would be able to handle the super bit and stay the same while others wouldn't; all would be criticized for whatever they did or didn't do and some of them wouldn't be able to handle that, and so on.
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